Please make iio/x, iv/x and viiø7/x available in Hookpad

I think it’s very unfortunate that iio/x and iv/x aren’t available in Hookpad as these are the most common predominants when tonicizing minor chords. I’m aware that iio/x can be accessed by flattening the 5th of a regular ii/x chord, but unfortunately this results in the chord label iio(♭5)/x which doesn’t make any sense when applied to minor chords, as the applied chord would then be derived from the corresponding minor scale and is thus diminished by default, so flattening the 5th again would result in a doubly flattened 5th.

grafik

Additionally I think it’s really odd that iii/x and vi/x which I’ve never seen before are available via the search bar, but viiø7/x isn’t although that one is fairly common. Heck, even I/x is available via the search bar - what on earth are we supposed to do with that one?

I don’t expect iio/x, iv/x and viiø7/x to be implemented into the Hookpad UI, but I think they should at least be available via the search bar, as they are very common in a lot of different musical styles.

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Agreed but also if we could just manually alter the chords (and scales too) it would be ideal as a skeleton key of sorts for every potential un-pre-programmed chord. :stuck_out_tongue:

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@DSchwachhofer I think these chords would be an important addition to ensure the accuracy of the transcriptions on the database.

Transcribing C - gm - A - dm as I - v(min) - V/ii - ii completely fails to convey the functional significance of gm in this progression, which is a shame considering Hooktheory’s emphasis on functional harmony.

There are countless examples of these chords on the database. Here are just a few of the most popular examples in case you don’t believe me:

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What about other variations of iiø and iv, like ♭II7(phr)? While I can’t think of any songs that use it as a secondary, Hookpad is not only a transcription tool, it’s also a writing tool, and I’ve used it in stuff I’ve written. Albeit with notation that fails to convey its functional significance.

There are other chords I want available for secondaries as well. In fact I don’t think it should be limited.

Curious to see some examples of a secondary iv. I didn’t see any in the examples you provided, but I may have just missed them since they’re impossible to label correctly.

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You’re correct - the list above only contains examples of iio/ii and iio/iii. My intention was to provide only the most popular examples of minor key secondaries that are available on the database. I wanted to demonstrate that these chords are relevant in western commercial pop music as that seems to be the primary focus of the developers.

From what I’ve seen iv/x doesn’t seem to be quite as common as iio/x, which isn’t too surprising given that ii/x seems to be a lot more common than IV/x when tonizing major chords (and yet IV/x is the one that’s integrated into the Hookpad UI :roll_eyes:).

Unfortunately due to how limited the Trends feature is (and how broken the search by chord feature is) I have no way to specifically search for examples of iv/iv, but below are some really nice examples of iv/ii (transcribed as v(min)). These seem to be especially common in East Asian pop ballads, which isn’t too surprising either considering their general fondness for functional harmony.

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Thanks for the examples. I guess tonicizing the other minor chords in this way would just reduce down to ii - V7/vi - vi and vi - V7/iii - iii. Kinda hard to argue in either case that ii is actually a iv/vi or that vi is actually iv/iii.

Yes, iv/x is only really relevant when tonicizing the dorian scale degree (ii in major, iv in minor, etc.) or when tonicizing non-diationic minor chords. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with labeling diatonic chords as applied predominants when they’re part of an actual tonicization though - some people write viio - V/vi - vi as iio/vi - V/vi - vi and I actually like that a lot, but it’s obviously not necessary to do it that way.

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